Friday, December 15, 2006

F-Train's comment

There would be more guarantees for your money if you had better AV protection or didn't download pr0n and warez that are infected with keyloggers. I'm not sure why the risk that you might download a keylogger should be shifted to FTP.

They gave you the hand histories and the IP address. What more should they do?

You also don't address the fact that, as far as FTP is concerned, you could be trying to defraud them. How does Full Tilt know that you didn't ask a friend to login to your account from a different site and dump your chips?
Thanks F-Train, I was waiting for someone to make this argument.

#1 - FTP is convinced that chip dumping DID NOT occur. So how could I be defrauding them? If chip dumping did occur, they would take the money from the recipient and give it back to me. Where's the profit in that?

That suspicion goes both ways, doesn't it? What's to prevent FTP from taking my money, doctoring some hand histories and making up an IP? Absoultely nothing. I have no way to verify that those hands actually occurred. I don't think this, but I don't have a good argument to convince a more paranoid person that it's not the case.

#2 - It's the assumption that I have a keylogger or spyware on my computer that bothers me. What if I didn't? My Anti-Virus protection is up to date. I've run every scanner I could download, even paying for some so I could find out if my system had been infected. Other than tracking cookies, they have found absolutely nothing. This is a brand new laptop install with basically nothing but OS and poker rooms and Yahoo Instant Messenger installed. If I can prove that my security was not at fault, will that get me anywhere? NO. What's more frustrating is that since I couldn't find anything, I have no idea if I am safe RIGHT NOW. They're very quick to assume the problem is totally my fault, and I'm not convinced. Especially as more and more people contact me who have had similar problems.

Is there a virus out there stealing FTP passwords? Is there spyware going around that steals that information? What is is called? Where has it been sighted? How many people have been affected? What SPECIFICALLY should I be on the lookout for?

#3 - What more should they do? More awareness that this is a possibility might have been nice.

I was at the blogger event in July when Howard Lederer spoke about how much his company does to protect customers from being ripped off. I didn't hear him mention this possibility. I was laboring under the false assumption that if something like this happened, FTP would be there to protect me. I was wrong and I learned my lesson.

I'm certainly not saying that any other poker room would handle this any differently, or that another poker system is safer that FTP. I actually thought that FTP was different, somehow better than most places that would just say "you're screwed, we're sorry." I was DEAD WRONG. My bad.

Had I been more aware, I would have left much less money in my account. But FTP doesn't want the constant deposit/withdrawal process that might actually have kept my money safe, because that would affect their bottom line. But now I know better, and hopefully anyone that reads this knows better too.

I'm not blaming FTP for ripping me off. I'm not saying people shouldn't play at FTP. I'm just saying don't leave big piles of money there. Yes, that's a pain in the ass, but unless you want to take that risk, you should do it.


Kipper said...

Do you use the same password for all your accounts? Or do you have a separate password for every account? If you use same password for all your 'internet' accounts perhaps it was compromised on another site not just FTP.

SirFWALGMan said...

It could be anything man.. Keyloggers and Spyware are only one way to get compromised.. Someone could have possibly guessed, hacked the FT front screen by brute guessing (not sure what protections are against that) or like I said they might know you and if you use Internet email that is a pretty easy way to get your passwords..

I agree totally with what you say about leaving large sums of money on ANY SITE.. (not just because I keep busting out either, heh).. Why give those companies interest you could collect yourself by say opening an E-bank and keeping the majority of your funds in that..

Anyway I am glad you clarified it was not just Full Tilt you were concerned with.. keep us posted..

HighOnPoker said...

I don't have much to add, but Duggles, my sincerest condolences. This would be my worst nightmare.

I also kinda wonder if someone targeted you specifically. I'm no Nancy Drew (although I do look cute in a skirt), but there are two things that make me wonder if it is personal: (1) You mentioned that whoever hacked you signed on immediately after you signed off. (2) If they didn't dump your money and withdraw it on another account, then what is the benefit to them aside from pissing you off. Also, the push with the inside straight draw looked like someone trying to lose.

The last thing, Duggles, is that you do have some enemies out there. What about that guy Shane or whatever his name was? I'm not saying it was him, but there are some reasons to think that it was personal.

Good luck, Duggles. If you need help getting a stake together, let me know.

Daddy said...

I seriously think it was just someone passing through that read your blog and thought, "Man, this guy is a real cumhungry pedderass. I bet his poker password is 'BoyToy69'."

He tried it.
It worked.
He got felted.
You got pissed.

There's a moral here, and it's to stay away from the children.

KrazyBangs said...

Sorry to hear man...

But with the amount of people spamming and scamming tables these days, it could be anything.

But hearing from people in the FTP forums about being hacked as well, this just sucks from hearing someone I read daily.

I heavily doubt you;d ever fall for the rediculous scams, but hope whatever happened, karma comes around and bitchslaps whoever fucked you over.

Anonymous said...

This isn't a very well known fact but... Tom Delay and Bill Frist both have accounts at FTP among other sites. This is why the Patriot Act was conceived - solely for online poker scams - and not to combat terrorism as conveniently stated.

In fact, the whole 9-11 and Pentagon attacks were plotted by Bush and Cheney along with other top Republicans as a front to gain access to online poker accounts with +/- $500.00 and a couple of tourney tokens.

As additional proof of this conspiracy, Full Tilt Poker is the laundering source for funds to propogate illegal wars on foreign soil just to keep the populace living in fear and retaining Republican leadership in the House, Congress and Capital Hill.

Think about it, Full Tilt Poker... FTP... Fuck The People! The Bush/Cheney toast at White House dinners.


P.S. Don't drink the water... Plutonium 210 you know. You may be digging in places you'd rather not be. And lastly listen to Daddy... STAY AWAY FROM THE KIDDIES!

P.P.S. Condie Rice isn't whom you think she is either. Reprts are she's actually from Talbor III the third Class M planet from a distance galaxy. WWdN is in on it too. I gotta go... Someone's lurking in the bushes outside...

Fuck The people! Fuck The People

MathP said...

I got the same treatment from Full Tilt. You are not alone into this, and it happened for both of us at the same time, which makes me think that THEY screwed up.

Full Tilt stole over 1k from me. I'll update on my blog soon as well. I am using a Mac and doubt I could have contracted any spyware or whatever. They'll have a hard time blaming me.

Anonymous said...

MathP - I have a hard time believe that a multimillion dollar company would steal from you, or other players. Isn't it in their best interest to keep money ON their site? I totally agree that we shouldn't treat our accounts like banks, but as much as we don't like it, it's another player like us who is picking our pockets.